Joyfully Growing in Grace and Torah

Growing in Him
It is currently Sun Jun 25, 2017 11:20 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 78 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:20 pm
Posts: 2476
Let's add a little wood to that fire. He's also got seven spirits :)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:25 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 7:34 pm
Posts: 152
Location: New Hampshire
I guess it all comes down to whom you believe.
Some things are fairly simple and we can really send ourselves chasing our tails by over-examination.

The following verses from John 10 essentially show Jesus saying the same thing to the Jews:
John 10:23. And Jesus was walking in the temple in Solomon’s porch. 24. Then the Jews encircled Him and said to Him, “How long are you going to hold us in suspense? If you are the Christ, tell us plainly.” 25. Jesus answered them, “I have told you, but you do not believe. The works that I am doing in My Father’s name, these bear witness of Me. 26. But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you. 27. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; and no one shall take them out of My hand. 29. My Father, Who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one has the power to seize them from My Father’s hand. 30. I and the Father are one.

There is not even a hint of a third person in this exchange.

Then, at Jesus' last Passover, after He instituted the New Covenant with the new symbols of the Christian Passover, this was His very, very important prayer to the Father:

John 17:5. And now, Father, glorify Me with Your own self, with the glory that I had with You before the world existed. 6. I have manifested Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, and You have given them to Me, and they have kept Your Word.
7. Now they have known that all things that You have given Me are from You. 8. For I have given them the words that You gave to Me; and they have received them and truly have known that I came from You; and they have believed that You did send Me. 9. I am praying for them; I am not praying for the world, but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10. All Mine are Yours, and all Yours are Mine; and I have been glorified in them.
11. And I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I am coming to You. Holy Father, keep them in Your name, those whom You have given Me, so that they may be one, even as We are one.
12. When I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. I protected those whom You have given Me, and not one of them has perished except the son of perdition, in order that the Scriptures might be fulfilled. 13. But now I am coming to You; and these things I am speaking while yet in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in them. 14. I have given them Your words, and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15. I do not pray that You would take them out of the world, but that You would keep them from the evil one. 16. They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world.
17. Sanctify them in Your truth; Your Word is the truth.
18. Even as You did send Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19. And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, so that they also may be sanctified in Your truth. 20. I do not pray for these only, but also for those who shall believe in Me through their word;
21. That they all may be one, even as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, in order that the world may believe that You did send Me. 22. And I have given them the glory that You gave to Me, in order that they may be one, in the same way that We are one: 23. I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected into one; and that the world may know that You did send Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.
24. Father, I desire that those whom You have given Me may also be with Me where I am, so that they may behold My glory, which You have given Me; because You did love Me before the foundation of the world. 25. Righteous Father, the world has not known You; but I have known You, and these have known that You did send Me. 26. And I have made known Your name to them, and will make it known; so that the love with which You have loved Me may be in them, and I in them.”

It doesn't get any clearer than that.
God is not three. There is God the Father and God the Son.

_________________
Grace and peace to you


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 10:33 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:19 pm
Posts: 428
Location: Iowa
I just have a minute before I get back to my cleaning of the attic. :smile:

But I agree totally with SoJ.

God the Father=Spiritual being [remained in "heaven"]; Son of God=God in the flesh came to the earth to 'buy back' Israel whom He had divorced.


Mt 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Mt 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

_________________
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge...Hosea 4:6


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:33 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:14 pm
Posts: 546
Wow. THIS is deep. FATHER is kind and merciful to His own.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:10 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:48 pm
Posts: 20
If this is true, then why does the Father say in the OT that he is the ONLY one ,our God, there will be none other. He does not change so why would he suddently change? you either believe him or not. oh yeah, He also says that there is NONE like him.....


Last edited by BamaDeb on Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:27 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
John 14. Nuff said. :tease:

Oh, wait, Psalm 110. Oh, wait, Genesis 18. Oh, wait, Genesis 1...

Isaiah 33:22 For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; he will save us.

Isaiah 48:16 Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me. 48:17 Thus saith the LORD, thy Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; I am the LORD thy God which teacheth thee to profit, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go.

2 Corinthians 13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.

:biggrin:

Echad cannot be possible without multiple points of reference, in this case THREE. However, we are not talking here about three persons, nor three entities, nor the Babylonian three-headed monster. We are talking about THE Over Soul (Father), who is THE Living Set Apart (Spirit), who fills and enlivens THE Eternal Body (Son); ECHAD, whole, and One. This is the pattern throughout the cosmos and is complete in us all: spirit, soul, and body...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:34 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
duckman1968 wrote:
Is this possible? Three equal persons?

Think about this for a day or so then answer if you'd like. In a marriage, where two are one....that is to be inside of a covenant with each other, two are one. What does that make a third partner, when a man is head of the woman?

Hint: Jesus would go around expelling this third being dwelling within those who were tormented by their/its presence.

This could be a very long, in depth study because wars will be fought over this very notion soon enough.


Oh, and I forgot to mention your third party in this analogy is the baby formed between the two in the mother's womb; thus, the two shall become one flesh. :smile:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:37 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
sonofJAC wrote:
It doesn't get any clearer than that.
God is not three. There is God the Father and God the Son.


Two Gods? :shock:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:11 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2011 1:49 pm
Posts: 1396
Judith wrote:
Let's add a little wood to that fire. He's also got seven spirits :)

He does? Can you elaborate.

I love you peeps. Each one has different studies that you have done and so informative. Please tell me about the 7 Spirits. :angelwings:

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2011 1:49 pm
Posts: 1396
sonofJAC wrote:
I guess it all comes down to whom you believe.
Some things are fairly simple and we can really send ourselves chasing our tails by over-examination.

The following verses from John 10 essentially show Jesus saying the same thing to the Jews:
John 10:23. And Jesus was walking in the temple in Solomon’s porch. 24. Then the Jews encircled Him and said to Him, “How long are you going to hold us in suspense? If you are the Christ, tell us plainly.” 25. Jesus answered them, “I have told you, but you do not believe. The works that I am doing in My Father’s name, these bear witness of Me. 26. But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you. 27. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; and no one shall take them out of My hand. 29. My Father, Who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one has the power to seize them from My Father’s hand. 30. I and the Father are one.

There is not even a hint of a third person in this exchange.

Then, at Jesus' last Passover, after He instituted the New Covenant with the new symbols of the Christian Passover, this was His very, very important prayer to the Father:

John 17:5. And now, Father, glorify Me with Your own self, with the glory that I had with You before the world existed. 6. I have manifested Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, and You have given them to Me, and they have kept Your Word.
7. Now they have known that all things that You have given Me are from You. 8. For I have given them the words that You gave to Me; and they have received them and truly have known that I came from You; and they have believed that You did send Me. 9. I am praying for them; I am not praying for the world, but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10. All Mine are Yours, and all Yours are Mine; and I have been glorified in them.
11. And I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I am coming to You. Holy Father, keep them in Your name, those whom You have given Me, so that they may be one, even as We are one.
12. When I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. I protected those whom You have given Me, and not one of them has perished except the son of perdition, in order that the Scriptures might be fulfilled. 13. But now I am coming to You; and these things I am speaking while yet in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in them. 14. I have given them Your words, and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15. I do not pray that You would take them out of the world, but that You would keep them from the evil one. 16. They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world.
17. Sanctify them in Your truth; Your Word is the truth.
18. Even as You did send Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19. And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, so that they also may be sanctified in Your truth. 20. I do not pray for these only, but also for those who shall believe in Me through their word;
21. That they all may be one, even as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, in order that the world may believe that You did send Me. 22. And I have given them the glory that You gave to Me, in order that they may be one, in the same way that We are one: 23. I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected into one; and that the world may know that You did send Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.
24. Father, I desire that those whom You have given Me may also be with Me where I am, so that they may behold My glory, which You have given Me; because You did love Me before the foundation of the world. 25. Righteous Father, the world has not known You; but I have known You, and these have known that You did send Me. 26. And I have made known Your name to them, and will make it known; so that the love with which You have loved Me may be in them, and I in them.”

It doesn't get any clearer than that.
God is not three. There is God the Father and God the Son.


I have not done an in depth study on this. I have only caught bits and pieces on SBs. I was taught all my life that the Father, Son and Holy Spirit is the trinity. 3 aspects of God. What is incorrect about that teaching. I do not understand.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2011 1:49 pm
Posts: 1396
Texas Jon wrote:
John 14. Nuff said. :tease:

Oh, wait, Psalm 110. Oh, wait, Genesis 18. Oh, wait, Genesis 1...

Isaiah 33:22 For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; he will save us.

Isaiah 48:16 Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me. 48:17 Thus saith the LORD, thy Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; I am the LORD thy God which teacheth thee to profit, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go.

2 Corinthians 13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.

:biggrin:

Echad cannot be possible without multiple points of reference, in this case THREE. However, we are not talking here about three persons, nor three entities, nor the Babylonian three-headed monster. We are talking about THE Over Soul (Father), who is THE Living Set Apart (Spirit), who fills and enlivens THE Eternal Body (Son); ECHAD, whole, and One. This is the pattern throughout the cosmos and is complete in us all: spirit, soul, and body...


Thanks I like they way you explained that.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:20 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
duckman1968 wrote:
Texas Jon wrote:
Oh, and I forgot to mention your third party in this analogy is the baby formed between the two in the mother's womb; thus, the two shall become one flesh. :smile:


Dang Texas...you've been hanging in the mesquite smoke too long. : )

A child comes from the partnership; it is not one of the partners...child comes from the love of the two in agreement forming one flesh.



:spiteful:

Hehe. Too much rain around here lately for mesquite smoke.

"Let US make MAN in OUR image..." Elohim in Echad made Ish/Isha. Then, Ish/Isha, being separated, made Seth in their image, and on, and on.

God is the Father of all, above all, through all, and IN all. Man is formed from God. A baby is formed from the union of the two male/female haploid gametes joining to become a zygote, BY THE SPIRIT! This is a basic picture of the Trinity: three spirits, who are all THE SAME SPIRIT!

You might go further than Einstein and check out Bohm who discovered that the particle has Consciousness. The real question is not, "Is God a Trinity," but it SHOULD BE, "How do we access the outer dimensions of YHWH?"...

Elohim: Father/Son/Spirit
Universe: Time/Space/Matter
Time: Past/Preset/Future
Space: Height/Length/Depth
Matter: Energy/Phenomenon/Motion
Atom: Proton/Neutron/Electron
Element: Solid/Liquid/Gas
Man: Spirit/Soul/Body

EVERYTHING is a Trinity. I like to ponder a tree: the source of life is the unseen root (Father), who sends forth the gnarly, ugly, strong and sturdy trunk (Son), who bears the leaves and fruit (Spirit). One Tree. On a side note, I love the fractalization of the universe, how the whole is contained within every part, like a leaf from a tree looks exactly like the tree it came from.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2011 4:26 pm
Posts: 242
Vectorwoman wrote:
Judith wrote:
Let's add a little wood to that fire. He's also got seven spirits :)

He does? Can you elaborate.

I love you peeps. Each one has different studies that you have done and so informative. Please tell me about the 7 Spirits. :angelwings:


The menorah in the Tabernacle (and later the Temples) represented the "seven spirits" of God. One lampstand with seven branches. Seven is the biblical number which symbolizes spiritual completeness. In Hebrew thought, seven = one (for example, seven days = one week; seven years = one sabbatical cycle, the 7th Jewish month on the civil calendar is the 1st month of their new year, etc.).

The "seven spirits" referenced in Revelation are symbolic of seven aspects of God's Holy Spirit:

Quote:
REVELATION 1:4 John, to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, (NKJV)

REVELATION 3:1 "And to the angel of the church in Sardis write, 'These things says he who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars: "I know your works, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead." (NKJV)

REVELATION 4:5 And from the throne proceeded lightnings, thunderings, and voices. Seven lamps of fire were burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God. (NKJV)

REVELATION 5:6 And I looked, and behold, in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as though it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent out into all the earth. (NKJV)

This seven-fold nature of God's Holy Spirit is spoken of in relation to the glorified Messiah in the OT prophetic book of Isaiah:

Quote:
ISAIAH 11:1 There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots.
2 The Spirit of YHVH shall rest upon him, the Spirit of wisdom and understanding, the Spirit of counsel and might, the Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of YHVH.

Isaiah defines the seven aspects this way:

1 - The Spirit of YHVH
2 - The Spirit of wisdom
3 - The Spirit of understanding
4 - The Spirit of counsel
5 - The Spirit of might
6 - The Spirit of knowledge
7 - The Spirit of the fear of YHVH

The Spirit is of YHVH (#1), but YHVH's Spirit here is defined by its attributes (#2-#7). Of course, God's Spirit obviously has more than six attributes. But besides the symbolic meaning of "7," the 6/7 pairing is also a Hebrew idiom (see Job 5:19-22 & Pro. 6:16-19).

Shabbat shalom!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:31 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:48 pm
Posts: 20
I don't believe in the Trinity.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 11:03 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
The Menorah makes a perfect example.

1. Gold is the pure metal of extracted from the mountain of YHWH's nature.
2. The Tree of Life is the image that was made from this beating, shaping, and forging of this pure metal.
3. Olive Oil then fills the image and set on fire.

:)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 6:00 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 22
Let's consider Isaah 43:10 where it is written YHVH has never nor will ever take on form.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:13 am
Posts: 142
Is 43:10;
10 Ye [are] My witnesses, an affirmation of Jehovah, And My servant whom I have chosen, So that ye know and give credence to Me, And understand that I [am] He, Before Me there was no God formed, And after Me there is none ( YLT )
doesnt really speak to me of not taking on a form, more like he is the only God ever. In fact the servant seems to indicate that there is more than one aspect to the Godhead.
I am with Tex on this one.
If you consider the model of the temple there was the whole thing, then an inner court then the Holy of holies.
Like people are a body ( outer court) a soul ( inner court ) and a Spirit ( the Holy of Holies ) So The Lord is the same.
Probably not the best explaination in the world but its how I see it.

_________________
יברכך יהוה וישמרך
יאר יהוה פניו אליך ויחנך
ישא יהוה פניו אליך וישם שלום


Yeh-va-reh-cheh-cha Yahveh veh-yeesh-meh-reh-cha
Ya-air Yahveh pa-naiv ay-leych-cha vee-chu-neh-cha
Yee-sa Yahveh pa-nahv ay-leyh-cha veh-ya-same leh-cha
Shalom


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:04 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 2:47 pm
Posts: 22
One can take the 3ism to make a case for the doctrine(s) of the trinity seem valid, but Scripture simply doesn't promite it. YHVH has appeared in many forms, from a burning bush, to a cloud, to fire, etc. But He wasn't formed, He wasn't created, He always has been, He is, and always will be for He is, just as He told Moses when asked who has sent him. YHVH reveals His many facets along the way and to whom He chooses. But that doesn't change Him, for He has always been YHVH and always will be.

The teaching(s) of the trinity have made Him into seperate "gods" rolled up to make one "god", which flies in the face of IDOLOTRY and is in fact the teachings of many pagan religions. I realize my belief on this isn't popular but that is how it is. We have to be careful with the Scriptures and with our relationship with YHVH....all the time. To claim He was formed, either phyisically or imagination is in fact idolotry as He has said. We have to take what He says as He says it not what was taught or how we want it to be for whatever reason. If we take it any other way, we are creating another "god".


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:15 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 6:39 pm
Posts: 1370
Well I have went round and round endlessly in my mind about this. I guess I used to believe in the 'trinity' but that was before when I truly knew nothing, I had no facts or study, I didn't even know. Once it came to light, I was appalled at what I had been doing, it seemed flat out idolatry, I was disgusted with myself. I agree we have to be very careful.
I did a short while ago come across some stuff that really gave me some peace regarding this matter. I just stumbled upon it really sort of by accident when reading and thinking about the right hand aspects of Yah. It gave a true and acceptable answer that I had been searching for.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:23 pm
Posts: 73
BamaDeb wrote:
I don't believe in the Trinity.


I do not believe in it either. I was taught it growing up in an old fashioned Lutheran Church though. From the 1950's and on. I am 62 years old now.

I left the 'church' over 30 years ago because of doctrine. I did NOT have a bad experience with my church growing up on the east coast. I loved God, I always believed in God, I had a good family and good friends in my Church growing up. I did not care for the Lutheran Churches and other churches in the Great Lakes region - farm/lake country and I left the Lutheran Church. My late husband quit his Lutheran Church in his small town due to DOCTRINE and the people - NO offense. The one he was confirmed in back there.

I have known many people in all kinds of religions. Good and bad in all of them even though we may disagree in some religious and political issues.

I think that the trinity is a false doctrine taught and the Christian churches fell for it. From the Council of Nicea - 325 AD and on.

I have studied many, many religions over the years and attended several churches. I will not bore you with the details.

God is God and He is not complicated to me.

The Trinity explanation was made up by the 'church fathers' to bring in the pagans in my opinion. Tons more and if you compare NON Christian, non Jewish and non Muslim religions aka pagans you will see where they have their own versions of the trinity using almost the same doctrine. You will see other things there that will make you go, hhhmmm.

If someone does believe in the trinity and they feel it is right... I wish them well.

I am a remarried widow and my husband does not want to join a church because he feels the same way about 'religion' and doctrine. He does study the Bible as I do. He and I do not always agree on some issues especially NOW when it comes to how we see GOD almighty. We do not argue about it but we do have some discussions about some Biblical verses.

Sincerely,

Catherine

_________________
Adieu


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:10 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:23 pm
Posts: 73
Simone wrote:
Well I have went round and round endlessly in my mind about this. I guess I used to believe in the 'trinity' but that was before when I truly knew nothing, I had no facts or study, I didn't even know. Once it came to light, I was appalled at what I had been doing, it seemed flat out idolatry, I was disgusted with myself. I agree we have to be very careful.
I did a short while ago come across some stuff that really gave me some peace regarding this matter. I just stumbled upon it really sort of by accident when reading and thinking about the right hand aspects of Yah. It gave a true and acceptable answer that I had been searching for.


JF, is this you?

I am glad that you found some peace and some answers.

Take care.

Cate aka Catherine_MT

_________________
Adieu


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:50 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 6:39 pm
Posts: 1370
Cate wrote:
Simone wrote:
Well I have went round and round endlessly in my mind about this. I guess I used to believe in the 'trinity' but that was before when I truly knew nothing, I had no facts or study, I didn't even know. Once it came to light, I was appalled at what I had been doing, it seemed flat out idolatry, I was disgusted with myself. I agree we have to be very careful.
I did a short while ago come across some stuff that really gave me some peace regarding this matter. I just stumbled upon it really sort of by accident when reading and thinking about the right hand aspects of Yah. It gave a true and acceptable answer that I had been searching for.


JF, is this you?

I am glad that you found some peace and some answers.

Take care.

Cate aka Catherine_MT



Hi lady, yes maam, it is I.


Great to have you over here with us. You won't find any censorship here, we may not always agree on things and have some widely varying views, but we sure all get to voice them without censor.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 5:08 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
Well... :D


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:46 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:23 pm
Posts: 73
Simone wrote:
Cate wrote:
Simone wrote:
Well I have went round and round endlessly in my mind about this. I guess I used to believe in the 'trinity' but that was before when I truly knew nothing, I had no facts or study, I didn't even know. Once it came to light, I was appalled at what I had been doing, it seemed flat out idolatry, I was disgusted with myself. I agree we have to be very careful.
I did a short while ago come across some stuff that really gave me some peace regarding this matter. I just stumbled upon it really sort of by accident when reading and thinking about the right hand aspects of Yah. It gave a true and acceptable answer that I had been searching for.


JF, is this you?

I am glad that you found some peace and some answers.

Take care.

Cate aka Catherine_MT



Hi lady, yes maam, it is I.


Great to have you over here with us. You won't find any censorship here, we may not always agree on things and have some widely varying views, but we sure all get to voice them without censor.


It is good to see you, lady.

Catherine

_________________
Adieu


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:02 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 6:39 pm
Posts: 1370
Texas Jon wrote:
Well... :D




lol.....well that is when you guys aren't beating me with sticks....

<kid> :s_cool


..I know you think you are beating sense into me... :biggrin:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:47 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
Ah, not really. I only use my sticks on my devil roosters... :smile:

I don't care if you believe or don't believe in a trinity position, so long as you believe in the One True YHWH. I even have a few friends who believe in multiple Gods. Why would I judge a man's heart if Daniel 7 portrays two deities? Is the Ancient of Days the same as the One like the Son of Man? I think so, but a few would charge that they are different.

I, myself, believe in the Triune aspect of YHWH, but I don't buy the idea that there are three persons whatsoever. Yahshua, as the Son, is the embodiment of the Father, who is also the Spirit. Echad.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 11:36 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:41 pm
Posts: 134
Vectorwoman wrote:
I was taught all my life that the Father, Son and Holy Spirit is the trinity. 3 aspects of God. What is incorrect about that teaching. I do not understand.

The term aspect lends itself to the concept of three separate gods, which is wrong. The Three Persons each possess in totality the one divine nature - God. The Three Persons are not separate; but, they are each distinct by way of relationship to one another.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:41 pm
Posts: 134
Texas Jon wrote:
[ ... ] I, myself, believe in the Triune aspect of YHWH, but I don't buy the idea that there are three persons whatsoever. Yahshua, as the Son, is the embodiment of the Father

Do you suggest that the Son is the Father?
Texas Jon wrote:
who is also the Spirit. Echad.

To whom do you refer? Is it the Father or is it the Son who is the Spirit?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:38 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:43 pm
Posts: 2177
Trans Am wrote:
Texas Jon wrote:
[ ... ] I, myself, believe in the Triune aspect of YHWH, but I don't buy the idea that there are three persons whatsoever. Yahshua, as the Son, is the embodiment of the Father

Do you suggest that the Son is the Father?
Texas Jon wrote:
who is also the Spirit. Echad.

To whom do you refer? Is it the Father or is it the Son who is the Spirit?


Yes, the Spirit, the Son, and the Father are all One Person. "I and the Father are ONE (Echad) [...] I will send you the Comforter [...] I will COMFORT you." Messiah is Father, Son, and Spirit, The Tree of Life...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 5:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:41 pm
Posts: 134
Texas Jon wrote:
Trans Am wrote:
Texas Jon wrote:
[ ... ] I, myself, believe in the Triune aspect of YHWH, but I don't buy the idea that there are three persons whatsoever. Yahshua, as the Son, is the embodiment of the Father

Do you suggest that the Son is the Father?
Texas Jon wrote:
who is also the Spirit. Echad.

To whom do you refer? Is it the Father or is it the Son who is the Spirit?


Yes, the Spirit, the Son, and the Father are all One Person. "I and the Father are ONE (Echad) [...] I will send you the Comforter [...] I will COMFORT you." Messiah is Father, Son, and Spirit, The Tree of Life...

Your understanding of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit as one person seems to render the following passage of Scripture total nonsense:

Quote:
But I have said these things to you, that when their hour comes you may remember that I told you of them.
I did not say these things to you from the beginning, because I was with you.

But now I am going to him who sent me; yet none of you asks me, `Where are you going?'

But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your hearts.

Nevertheless I tell you the truth: it is to your advantage that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.

And when he comes, he will convince the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment:

concerning sin, because they do not believe in me;

concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father, and you will see me no more;

concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

I have yet many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now.

When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.

He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you.

All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you. [John 16:4-15]


Why is there a distinction made with the terms "Father" and "him" in reference to the Father; "I" and "me" in reference to Jesus; and "Counselor", "he", "him", and "Spirit of truth" in reference to the Holy Spirit; yet you consider them all one person?


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 78 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron

Forum hosting by ProphpBB | Software by phpBB | Report Abuse | Privacy